Questionnaire: Truby's Remarks On Your Questionnaire Re Miscellaneous Questions, by Albert E. Truby, February 1947

    The original of this is posted in the set of miscellaneous
questions. I feel that I have mixed & messed things
badly. Perhaps your secretary can re type questions
and my comments so they will be where they belong
A.E.T.

    TRUBY'S REMARKS ON YOUR QUESTIONNAIRE
RE MISCELLANEOUS QUESTIONS
FEBRUARY, 1947

    Truby's remarks on your questionnaire re miscellaneous questions (Dec. 1946).

    Agramonte's statement in the Scientific Monthly must help to confirm
in your mind my statements about his writings after Carroll's death (1908).
[I] As you know, I have labelled such remarks as Bunk in my Sen. Doc. and elsewhere.
Also compare Agramonte's statement about "Verbal instructions" from one of
Reed's letters. (See Sternberg Biography, P. 217 - note)

     [II] I think your conclusions are absolutely correct. Of course, I had seen
everything about this matter in the Sternberg Biography and the note, Pg. 24,
in the Sen. Doc., but I do not remember seeing the actual written instructions.
The very general instructions in the Sen. Doc. make it clear that the Surgeon
General gave Reed full authority to follow his own plans, but to "give special
attention to questions relating to the etiology and prevention of yellow fever."
As previously stated, I never questioned Sternberg's statements re this, even as
late as when I wrote my book, and was astounded when you pointed out these facts in
your recent questionnaire to Kean (1946). See my book, pg. 89. I will have to revise
that when and if the book is reprinted.

    NOTE: My short notes in ink on the margin supplement my general remarks.

     [*] Number of Huts

    The maps of March, 1899 and 1901, together with the Perez model are
more reliable than Lambert. I have not had an interview with him and he gave me
most of the data for my book in letters which I thought you had. I cannot find
them here. When I gave you his letters I think I also gave you letters from
General Kean and Andrus. Won't you look them all up and see if any of Lambert's
are among them. I will look here too. Lambert, Pinto and I all agreed on what
is written in my book. That was in 194 2 [1] , I think. When Pinto wrote his notes,
which are pasted in the copy of the manuscript which you have, he had the manu-
script and a map of the hospital. His notes were written at his home where he
must have had access to any notes or papers on Cuba in his possession. I doubt
if he had any, however. When he was here in San Francisco, I showed him the
finished manuscript and we talked of the huts as noted in my book. Why he changed
his story I can't imagine.

    Lambert's attitude I can understand because he is now trying to discredit
me since I did not recommend Ames and himself for the Medal of Honor. Lambert
wrote me after he had read my book and was bitter about my remarks on pg. 191 and
192 on this matter. I cut him off short with a letter after my illness, stating
that I could not agree with him and was not able physically to discuss the matter
further. I have not heard from him since.

    *See p 55 " miscellaneous questions [my book] " re the size
of the huts.

    2

     [*] In my book pg. 51, the key to the buildings shows 119 and 120 as
Kitchens, 117 and 118 as 5-bed huts, 115 and 116 as 2-bed huts, and 113 and
114 as storage and Ame's office. Of course, the buildings were used for
various purposes at different times even though they were all called wards.
The duty personnel, both male and female, had to be sheltered and then they
had to store things and cook. But, generally speaking, the southern row of
wards was used for the sick and the northern for duty personnel. As a rule
116 and 118 took care of most of the sick. There were probably never more than
three or four patients [very sick patients] there at any one time I am quite sure. That can be
checked up.

     [IV] The photo of the small hut is a lucky find and is the real thing.
It also refutes Lambert about windows. The hospital buildings in the Perez
model, as I have often told you, were excellent reproductions as to size,
shape and outside details. It was very badly set up on the base-board.
I conceived the idea of having the buildings set up on similar terrain and
photographed. But at Carlisle, they were busy getting ready for war at the
time and the ground selected was not well chosen and the photographic result
a failure as the ground looks flat. The contours should have been greatly
exagerated to show up properly in a photo. The approximate distance between
buildings was, however, quite accurate. When the buildings were set up on
the ground at Carlisle the front entrances could easily have been faced East.
However, I think that they actually faced West originally and that is evidently
shown in the photograph. I think you have guessed right and that the large hut
at the right is 118 (Lazear's). The smaller one 116 (Carroll's), the one by the
tree 114 (Ame's office), while the dark object is probably the ambulance, which
always had to park there. This I also know, for before we had a bridge over
the railroad cut we used the ambulance. It was easy to go to the railroad
junction at Quemados and then pass down the west side of the railroad cut
on the camp level. I went that way myself on horseback and in the ambulance.
The tree is probably the same one you saw in 1940 but I don't remember it.

     [IV cont'd] We had no Officer's Ward in 1900. Building No. 93 was finished after
I left in November, 1900, and it did have a place for officers. In my time,
most sick officers were treated in their quarters where they had better
accommodations than the hospital afforded. Dr. Saleeby took care of them and
when necessary we aided him with nurses. Of course it is perfectly absurd to
say that Carroll and Lazear were treated in the Officer's Ward on the main
hospital. Why did we have an isolation camp? Yellow Fever cases had to be
isolated by orders from the top. And besides, if I, the hospital C. O. then,
had permitted Lazear to stay in the Post Hospital, I would have been dismissed
from the service very promptly. Is Lambert crazy or just plain malicious?

     [V] Read what I said about Rasmussen and Lambert in my book, pg. 109.
Lambert gave me this information. Rasmussen was a very intelligent and
reliable enlisted man. I remember him very well and when I was Chief Surgeon
[1924 to 1926] in the Philippines, he was a Master Sgt. and on duty in charge of the work in
my office. We frequently talked of Camp Columbia and the [his] work there and so
I was not surprised when Lambert spoke of him.

    *See p 55 book re size of huts

    3

     [IV]
In my book I do not think that I made any statement re the huts based
on my own memory but I did not include any statements of Lambert's either
which I considered wrong. All of Pinto's statements about the huts were
included unchanged, I think, as you can see from his written notes. I myself
had very positive ideas about the general situation at the yellow fever camp.
For instance, I knew that the small huts 113 and 114 were never used for the
sick while I was there. It is perfectly ridiculous to suppose that Kean,
Carroll, or Lazear would have been placed in such a tiny hut when fine,
roomy, large ones were available. Huts 113 and 114 were probably not more
than 6 or 8 × 9 feet. They were evidently built for one person, probably a
non-commissioned officer in charge of the row of huts. The other huts were
about the dimensions given in my book. Think how hard it would have been to
care for a seriously ill, constantly wretching patient, in that small space.
Sometimes two nurses would have to be there too. Someone all the time. Then,
too, I have in the back of my head the idea that we never used the northern
row for patients. The duty personnel used those huts and one building may
have been used for convalescent patients. By keeping patients in certain
buildings permanently, they did not have to be disinfected constantly as they
would have if Lambert's program had been followed. Besides, all this, Ames
wanted to be near his patients. Hence, as I feel sure Ames stayed in 114, the
next two (large huts) 116 and 118 were in almost constant use. Ames would
never walk a step if an ambulance was available. Even when the bridge was
there he usually went to the yellow fever camp in one and it was habitually
parked where the "dark object" appears in the photo. So, when I saw that
picture, the idea came to me at once, that is Ames' ambulance. The longer I
think about it the more convinced I am that it is the ambulance. It is the
right size and in the right place.

    From all this there is not the slightest doubt that Kean, Carroll, Lazear
and Cartwright were all in the southern row but I can't specify which hut the
different ones were in. In the case of Carroll and Lazear, no doctor in his
right mind would have placed them both at the same time in the same room.
So I think Pinto's mind was working OK on that point and I had the same opinion
before I heard his views. There was always plenty of room, especially if
convalescents were removed to other huts.

    The camp had other duty personnel besides the three immune women and
Lambert. Rasmussen was there, also a cook and other general helpers (as needed)
who probably had no contact with the sick. All lived and messed there. After
Lazear's death the camp was very inactive until patients came from Camp Lazear.
A portion of one of Pinto's statemen

    When Kissinger came, Ames put Lambert in charge of the nursing at Camp
Lazear and the women probably helped. Ames, I think did not have much confidence
in Mrs. Warner and her helpers after Lazear's case. I believe that they helped
in the Andrus' case.

    The yellow fever camp was always independent of the main hospital and had
its own equipment and supplies. Yellow fever was still considered a contagious
disease and we carried out all precautions under orders, of course. The
main kitchen may have sent cooked food, under certain precautions, at times for
the duty personnel.

    4

    Lambert positively gave me the information that Ames relieved him
from duty at the yellow fever camp and put him in charge of the disinfecting
plant, after instruction in the work at Havana. He did not return to duty [at the camp] until
after Lazear's death when they [unclear]   [had no further use for] Mrs. Warner. He had a room in the
plant all the time he was working for Ames. [and staid there when he could
and I think both developed YF. One died, after that Mrs Warner came from Havana]

    When women came to the camp from Quemados with yellow fever, Ames had
to get a female nurse. Mrs. Warner, an immune, came from Havana and one or two
other women who were immunes helped her. Our regular nurses were not immunes.
Rasmussen, was on duty at the camp with them according to Lambert. I tried to
get in touch with Rasmussen and wrote to Lull in the S.G.O. who informed me
that he had died.

     [Two of our non-immune nurses were on the Edmunds cases]

    Among other things, Lambert told me that one night when Carroll was
wild (delerious) Mrs. Warner sent someone over to his room in the disinfecting
plant (building 111, pg. 51, my book) and asked him to come over and help them.
He did so and said they had a hard time controlling Carroll. Please notice the
reference to pg. 51 where it states "Lambert's quarters." Rasmussen was not
available that night, probably on pass.

    It must be since 1943 (when I became ill) that Lambert changed his mind
about the place where Carroll and Lazear were treated. He has figured me down
and out and could therefore discredit my statements for his own purposes. I
feel sure he is doing this willfully and maliciously. I expect General Kean
Knows that he, Lazear and Carroll were all sick at the yellow fever camp.
Pinto knew it too, notmatter how mixed up he was on the particular huts.
[I am sure Kean will agre with me in this.]

     [V. contd.] Lambert had no leave (see typed remarks elsewhere.) Andrus was at the
camp with yellow fever late in January 1901. See my book pg. 174. Pinto left
Cuba November 10, 1900, shortly before I left for Cienfuegos. I think Pinto's
letters to me may confirm this. I have told this to Lambert in letters several
times. He is therefore again trying to discredit my statements. The facts can
be obtained from the War Department. [I think Amador was the doctor.]

    I will search for Lambert's letters. I suggest that if you do not
have them that you read the letters from Andrus. He obtained for me many
details from Lambert re the yellow fever camp before I started to write to
the latter. You might find something re the huts and Lambert's work in them.
You have all of my letters from Pinto and Andrus, I think. The letters from
Andrus are full of information which I found most reliable. Don't you agree?
If you have not read them, please do so. Andrus was honest and had nothing to
gain by giving false information. He thought that Lambert should have been on
the Roll of Honor. But I doubt if he knew of the requirements specified by the
War Department.

     - 2-   [ #5]

    Lambert never mentions any help except the three women. So I am glad
your questions have brought out my views on this. He lived in the disinfecting
plant most of the time but messed at the camp. None of the duty personnel could
eat at the main hospital mess and they could not mix with the men in the main
hospital. The disinfecting plant and yellow fever camp were both under Ames.

    From these general remarks I hope to convince you that I knew in 1900 and
still know the general set up at the camp. I don't pretend to know many of the
details. But when others make statements that seem absurd to me I can form a
fairly accurate idea about them. When I had the opinion of two or more of our
old men I had to use my general information to arrive at conclusions. Sometimes
it may have been a bad guess, of course. You will notice that in my book in
one case, at least, I even cut out a portion of one of Pinto's statements because
I questioned it.

    Carroll was still at the camp when I arrived at Camp Columbia, September 18,
and I think he was still there when Reed returned on October 4. "In the back
of my head" there is something that makes me think that I saw Reed and Ames drive
away in an ambulance to visit Carroll within a short time after Reed arrived.
Therefore, in my opinion, Carroll could only have seen Lazear at the yellow fever
camp if he was able to walk from hut 116 to 118. Sometimes I have even doubted
that he ever saw Lazear during his illness. Agramonte claimed that too, and
you gave me the reason why he did not. You will find by the records, if you
can find them, that Carroll was on sick report quite a long time for a yellow
fever case. When Ames finally let him come back to his room in the bachelor
building, he moped around there for several days while he was still marked quarters.
He finally complained to Reed because Ames would not mark him duty. Reed talked
to both Ames and me about it and it was concluded to mark him duty to satisfy him.
He was in no condition to do any real work in the laboratory and Reed had to
send him home to the U.S.

    I have been quite upset by the developments in this hut question. There is
something wrong with someone. I took Lambert's word for what he wrote me and
Andrus back in 1938 and 1940 and did not differ with him much. In 1942 something
went wrong. Lambert began to change his earlier statements and those you have
quoted in your questionnaire are still worse. This is what I think may have been
the reason. My manuscript was finished December 7, 1941, just as I heard the
radio tell of the Jap attack. Soon thereafter, I sent a copy of the manuscript
to F. F. Russell and that copy soon went to Andrus. One went to you later.
Lambert did not see a copy for he was so insistent on being recommended for the
Roll of Honor that I kept him in ignorance of what I would say on that point.
So, I imagine, that Andrus, quite naturally, told him my remarks re the Roll of
Honor for Ames and himself.

    Well, I have had my say. Now you can do a bit of guessing. Some of the
facts can't be determined, of course, but you have unearthed many important ones.
Keep it up. And generally those I have seen, substantiate my story. The little
photo of the huts and the sanitary report of March 31, 1899 are new and very
gratifying. Pinto told me the story re smallpox huts. See pg. 54, my book.

    - 3 [6] -

     [*] Pinto, too, was sore for some reason or other. One reason, I think, was
that he saw the large picture of Corwell's here in my "work shop", and he
thought Stark should have been in my place, I gathered. I think he thought
that he too should have been in it. Anyway, I never heard from him after that
visit although I wrote him and sent him an inscribed copy of my book.

     [See p.13A] If you analyze this paragraph you will find that the maximum number in the
hospital at one time was 5: Carroll, DeLong, McKenna, Turner, XY. They could
all have been cared for in hut 118, but probably were placed in the two huts,
116 and 118.

    After September 16, there were only 4 - Carroll, Cartwright, Lazear and a
convalescent, DeLong. Not a big nursing load with plenty of help to do the other
ghings necessary in the camp. I know Lambert said he was away from sometime in
August until after Lazear was admitted to the hospital. He told me so and I am
quite sure Ames sent him to Military Hospital No. 1 or to the Quarantine Station
in Havana, for instruction in running our disinfecting plant. During this time,
he may have slept in his room at the plant.

     [p.14B] The four buildings in the smallpox row were separated from the yellow fever
row by about 200 feet, I think. You can get it nearer right from the scale on
your large map. The 2nd Division Hospital was right on the job and prepared for
the expected cases of yellow fever. But I believe they had none. In the meantime,
they did have some cases of smallpox and so put up the 2nd row of huts, each row
with its own kitchen. The buildings in each row were not, I think, as far apart
as the two rows were from each other. Your discovery of this sanitary report with
dates is important.

    * I do not wish to imply that Pinto was deliberately
trying to discredit me as I feel that Lambert is doing.